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	<title>Comments on: Christmas can be a lonely time</title>
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	<link>http://lordsoftheblog.net/2008/12/24/christmas-can-be-a-lonely-time/</link>
	<description>Life and Work in the House of Lords</description>
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		<title>By: howridiculous</title>
		<link>http://lordsoftheblog.net/2008/12/24/christmas-can-be-a-lonely-time/comment-page-1/#comment-2576</link>
		<dc:creator>howridiculous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 20:50:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lordsoftheblog.wordpress.com/?p=1343#comment-2576</guid>
		<description>Dear Lord Norton - If people are physically able to get to shops, they ought to be able to do voluntary work.

Dear McDuff - I presume you think provincialism is a bad thing?  Anyway, I am from The North, which no doubt you regard as deeply provincial, so take a &#039;belt up&#039; attitude to life.  Reading your comments, I was reminded of a Victoria Wood sketch which went along the following lines: &#039;There was no such thing as hysterectomies in my day.  You just crossed your legs and switched the radio up.&#039;

And, of course, anyone can go Church whatever their religious affilitation, if any.  Perhaps if people of different faiths did occasionally attend one another&#039;s services the world would be a better place.

Howridiculous.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Lord Norton &#8211; If people are physically able to get to shops, they ought to be able to do voluntary work.</p>
<p>Dear McDuff &#8211; I presume you think provincialism is a bad thing?  Anyway, I am from The North, which no doubt you regard as deeply provincial, so take a &#8216;belt up&#8217; attitude to life.  Reading your comments, I was reminded of a Victoria Wood sketch which went along the following lines: &#8216;There was no such thing as hysterectomies in my day.  You just crossed your legs and switched the radio up.&#8217;</p>
<p>And, of course, anyone can go Church whatever their religious affilitation, if any.  Perhaps if people of different faiths did occasionally attend one another&#8217;s services the world would be a better place.</p>
<p>Howridiculous.</p>
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		<title>By: lordnorton</title>
		<link>http://lordsoftheblog.net/2008/12/24/christmas-can-be-a-lonely-time/comment-page-1/#comment-2575</link>
		<dc:creator>lordnorton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 15:33:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lordsoftheblog.wordpress.com/?p=1343#comment-2575</guid>
		<description>McDuff: On your second paragraph, my point was not specific to a particular day but, as you surmise, to the principle of not forcing people to work without a break.  I do not believe in putting people in a situation where they are forced to work seven days a week.  Conversely, I do not believe in forcing people not to work seven days a week if that is what they genuinely wish to do.  It must be a matter of choice on the part of the individual.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>McDuff: On your second paragraph, my point was not specific to a particular day but, as you surmise, to the principle of not forcing people to work without a break.  I do not believe in putting people in a situation where they are forced to work seven days a week.  Conversely, I do not believe in forcing people not to work seven days a week if that is what they genuinely wish to do.  It must be a matter of choice on the part of the individual.</p>
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		<title>By: McDuff</title>
		<link>http://lordsoftheblog.net/2008/12/24/christmas-can-be-a-lonely-time/comment-page-1/#comment-2574</link>
		<dc:creator>McDuff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 14:47:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lordsoftheblog.wordpress.com/?p=1343#comment-2574</guid>
		<description>Lord Norton

It was indeed a musing commentary rather than a vociferous disagreement.  The cut and thrust of swashbuckling internet debate is all well and good, but it is also sometimes relevant to talk about things even if we don&#039;t strictly disagree.

You support the rights to take Christmas and Sundays, I assume it goes without saying that you support Saturdays (the Jewish Sabbath) and other religious holy days too.  We are too concerned with squeezing productivity out of our populations in this country, and if religion can provide some respite by allowing us to enforce idleness then all the better for it.

That being said...


Howridiculous

I&#039;m afraid you may want to button your fly, your provincialism is showing.  &quot;They can always go to Church,&quot; indeed - even the Jews, Muslims and atheists? And as for the &quot;luxury&quot; of time to feel lonely, my dear sir, you could not show yourself more tone deaf to the concerns of loneliness and social atomisation if you had hired a PR firm specifically to put across that exact image.  As alluded to by Lord Norton, sometimes those who are lonely and those who are needy at Christmas are the same people!  Should they volunteer to bring &lt;i&gt;themselves&lt;/i&gt; a hot mince pie?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lord Norton</p>
<p>It was indeed a musing commentary rather than a vociferous disagreement.  The cut and thrust of swashbuckling internet debate is all well and good, but it is also sometimes relevant to talk about things even if we don&#8217;t strictly disagree.</p>
<p>You support the rights to take Christmas and Sundays, I assume it goes without saying that you support Saturdays (the Jewish Sabbath) and other religious holy days too.  We are too concerned with squeezing productivity out of our populations in this country, and if religion can provide some respite by allowing us to enforce idleness then all the better for it.</p>
<p>That being said&#8230;</p>
<p>Howridiculous</p>
<p>I&#8217;m afraid you may want to button your fly, your provincialism is showing.  &#8220;They can always go to Church,&#8221; indeed &#8211; even the Jews, Muslims and atheists? And as for the &#8220;luxury&#8221; of time to feel lonely, my dear sir, you could not show yourself more tone deaf to the concerns of loneliness and social atomisation if you had hired a PR firm specifically to put across that exact image.  As alluded to by Lord Norton, sometimes those who are lonely and those who are needy at Christmas are the same people!  Should they volunteer to bring <i>themselves</i> a hot mince pie?</p>
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		<title>By: lordnorton</title>
		<link>http://lordsoftheblog.net/2008/12/24/christmas-can-be-a-lonely-time/comment-page-1/#comment-2573</link>
		<dc:creator>lordnorton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jan 2009 22:15:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lordsoftheblog.wordpress.com/?p=1343#comment-2573</guid>
		<description>McDuff: As I mentioned, I was not opposed to the Bill.  I certainly believe that no one should have to work on Christmas Day (or for that matter Sundays) if they do not wish to and that legislation is necessary to provide that protection.  Howridiculous: Attending Church may not be an option for those who are not believers.  Voluntary work is certainly to be lauded, though some of those who seek company on a Sunday may not themselves by physically able to engage in such work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>McDuff: As I mentioned, I was not opposed to the Bill.  I certainly believe that no one should have to work on Christmas Day (or for that matter Sundays) if they do not wish to and that legislation is necessary to provide that protection.  Howridiculous: Attending Church may not be an option for those who are not believers.  Voluntary work is certainly to be lauded, though some of those who seek company on a Sunday may not themselves by physically able to engage in such work.</p>
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		<title>By: howridiculous</title>
		<link>http://lordsoftheblog.net/2008/12/24/christmas-can-be-a-lonely-time/comment-page-1/#comment-2572</link>
		<dc:creator>howridiculous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jan 2009 15:55:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lordsoftheblog.wordpress.com/?p=1343#comment-2572</guid>
		<description>Dear Lord Norton,

As someone who has worked in the retail sector and knowing how employers work, I am sure opening shops is not the answer.

If people feel lonely at Christmas, and on Sundays, and are in need of social interaction they can always go to Church.  Failing that, they can always do voluntary work for people less fortunate than themselves, people who do not have the luxury of time to feel lonely.

Howridiculous.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Lord Norton,</p>
<p>As someone who has worked in the retail sector and knowing how employers work, I am sure opening shops is not the answer.</p>
<p>If people feel lonely at Christmas, and on Sundays, and are in need of social interaction they can always go to Church.  Failing that, they can always do voluntary work for people less fortunate than themselves, people who do not have the luxury of time to feel lonely.</p>
<p>Howridiculous.</p>
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		<title>By: McDuff</title>
		<link>http://lordsoftheblog.net/2008/12/24/christmas-can-be-a-lonely-time/comment-page-1/#comment-2571</link>
		<dc:creator>McDuff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 03:03:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lordsoftheblog.wordpress.com/?p=1343#comment-2571</guid>
		<description>For those people working minimum wage, often ununionised jobs, it can do good to have the government enforce a day when your employer cannot say to you &quot;you must come in, family commitments be damned.&quot;

I fear that the true solution to the problem would be a shift of our economic and social priorities to reflect that many people would rather be gainfully employed than slavishly devoted to an employer.  In the meantime, while we are still somewhat abusive and broken, favouring one religion over another and inconveniencing a minority of people on one day of the year is probably a fair price to pay for the general protections for labour such measures provide.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For those people working minimum wage, often ununionised jobs, it can do good to have the government enforce a day when your employer cannot say to you &#8220;you must come in, family commitments be damned.&#8221;</p>
<p>I fear that the true solution to the problem would be a shift of our economic and social priorities to reflect that many people would rather be gainfully employed than slavishly devoted to an employer.  In the meantime, while we are still somewhat abusive and broken, favouring one religion over another and inconveniencing a minority of people on one day of the year is probably a fair price to pay for the general protections for labour such measures provide.</p>
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		<title>By: beatis</title>
		<link>http://lordsoftheblog.net/2008/12/24/christmas-can-be-a-lonely-time/comment-page-1/#comment-2570</link>
		<dc:creator>beatis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 23:24:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lordsoftheblog.wordpress.com/?p=1343#comment-2570</guid>
		<description>I was very touched by your argument of Christmas being a lonely time for some people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was very touched by your argument of Christmas being a lonely time for some people.</p>
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		<title>By: Clare</title>
		<link>http://lordsoftheblog.net/2008/12/24/christmas-can-be-a-lonely-time/comment-page-1/#comment-2569</link>
		<dc:creator>Clare</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Dec 2008 15:55:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lordsoftheblog.wordpress.com/?p=1343#comment-2569</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s a good point! It&#039;s also worth bearing in mind the case of those who don&#039;t celebrate this religious holiday too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s a good point! It&#8217;s also worth bearing in mind the case of those who don&#8217;t celebrate this religious holiday too.</p>
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		<title>By: Troika21</title>
		<link>http://lordsoftheblog.net/2008/12/24/christmas-can-be-a-lonely-time/comment-page-1/#comment-2568</link>
		<dc:creator>Troika21</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Dec 2008 11:56:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lordsoftheblog.wordpress.com/?p=1343#comment-2568</guid>
		<description>Thank you Lord Norton, Merry Christmas!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you Lord Norton, Merry Christmas!</p>
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		<title>By: lordnorton</title>
		<link>http://lordsoftheblog.net/2008/12/24/christmas-can-be-a-lonely-time/comment-page-1/#comment-2567</link>
		<dc:creator>lordnorton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Dec 2008 23:47:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lordsoftheblog.wordpress.com/?p=1343#comment-2567</guid>
		<description>Troika21: As one of the few peers to speak was a Bishop, the religious dimension was rather central to the debate.  And in earlier years the religious argument was very much to the fore in the opposition to the deregulation of Sunday trading; indeed, the churches played a leading role in the opposition that led to the demise of the Shops Bill in 1986. The sze of large stores was speficied in the Bill: you are right that it was essentially stores likes Tesco.  Your last point ties in with your first: the religious importance of Christmas has rather been swamped by commercialisation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Troika21: As one of the few peers to speak was a Bishop, the religious dimension was rather central to the debate.  And in earlier years the religious argument was very much to the fore in the opposition to the deregulation of Sunday trading; indeed, the churches played a leading role in the opposition that led to the demise of the Shops Bill in 1986. The sze of large stores was speficied in the Bill: you are right that it was essentially stores likes Tesco.  Your last point ties in with your first: the religious importance of Christmas has rather been swamped by commercialisation.</p>
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